Interesting Ore Gen

BendrickMy todo list for next update will be reworking how collapses are triggered and going back to more or less vanilla collapse block logic (Triggering vanilla cave-ins will be what I mess with, everything else will be more or less vanilla). For the most part, this is just because I used vanilla code in a way it was not designed. I tried fixing it at one point but I recall not great results. It should hopefully be fixed for my next major update. Likely some months away, but no promises.

Hey RosstheGreat I love the concept of this mod, and appreciate that you've been tweaking it for a while. Something I've come across on my server (I've tried to isolate it in single player to just your mod and default settings (+cave-ins)) is ore duplication, the situation is quite specific but hopefully you can replicate and figure out a solution (if it's not somehow my fault!).

You can mine a block (with instability 0-100%) that is on top of a block-type that has no instability and allows it to pass through or slide over (or is free floating!), if the mined ore block triggers the search for a nearby 100% instability block, if there is one it will trigger your epicenter system, however if the radius from the epicenter encapsulates the original mined block, you will recieve the mined block (normal) AND a version of it will be spawned to cave-in from its position. Effectively this lets you duplicate any block that caves-in and has instability %. Unless I'm misunderstanding.

To replicate: Place 1 dirt block, place 1 copper ore block on top, then mine the copper ore block. If there are no nearby blocks with instability, it will only find itself (at 100%) and therefore drop both the copper chunks, and spawn another copper ore block that slides off / falls through 1 block thin platforms. This also happens if you place two coppers apart and the "secondary epicenter" backup system triggers, but the two blocks are close enough that the radius of the epicenter from the 2nd block encapsulates the first. (Think it's like 4-5 blocks).

This behavior does not happen with vanilla cave-ins. They simply break the mined block, and nearby blocks fall, it does not create a new one in the original's place.

I suggest either checking the system cannot self select the first block, in either the primary radius or the radius of the secondary epicenter (by making sure it's always triggered by a minimum distance). There may be another cause here but that's all I could find, let me know if it's okay to temporarily fork this for my private server, love the mod!

ImGonnaCrumb There is not currently a way to adjust spawnrate down. There is a bug that causes the maximum ore generation to be 0.01 (1%) and causes that as the floor for the minimum generation. Eventually there will be, but I'm on hiatus from modding at the moment, friend group moved on to other games and I haven't had the motivation to hop back in and do anything yet as that's a big fix for me.

Luin That is a vanilla feature, and a result of how vanilla instability works. I only mess with the actual cave-in shape currently and what triggers searches. Why it's built like that I don't know.

Ciber No config currently, eventually there will be. Surface bits are a result of it not replacing grass, and I had to overtune them. In areas with less vegetation you'll notice more bits, with more grass in areas you can actually have no bits spawn at all if you're extremely unlucky. In my test worlds I had several ore veins I had no indication was there, and that caused me to overtune them. Eventually the bits were meant to be replaced with other indicator forms such as plants, mushrooms, and other small stained stones bearing some form of indication of host rock/ore. For now, it's bits. 😅

GOODYOB I apprecaite the kind words! cave-ins can be disabled with a worldgen setting (there is a command too, I don't recall what it is) as a holdover if you just don't want caveins. Vanilla cave-ins are really boring, in my opinion, and my current implementation was quite a fun challenge for me and my group so that's why it currently is the way it is. My next stint (When I don't know) has quite a long to-do list but chiefly among them is fixing up the current implementation of cave-ins. Part of why I have them in-built into IOG (and for a while was going to leave it like that) was because a lot of people complain(ed) about the ore gen being too easy. To counter that ease I figured making mine reinforcement and preperation a challenge and resource sink would be a good alternative. I'm still not *certain* on flat out removing cave-ins from IOG for that, but I will for sure have a config of some kind eventually for them.
I'm also changing them in the next update to be less harsh and much more interesting.However, again, that's when I get the motivation to sit down for several days and actually get through my To-Do list.

I absolutely love your mod, but I beg of you to separate cave-ins and other systems you might want to implement in the future into separate mods.
I think its safe to say that I'm speaking for a large portion of the community when I say that when we get a mod that adds cool new ore veins generation, we want cool ore veins and not a harder cave-in system

Played for a bit. I can't seem to find any config file in the standard config folder?
Surface bits definitely too plentiful.

How come some rocks have higher instability than the rock below it? I'v seen 100% instability ON TOP of 0% and I think that has been creating unexpected cave-ins in places that look fine when using a pickbar but have a 100% instability hidden in the roof.

Is there a way to adjust the rarity of the ore generation? I'm finding way too many surface bits distributed among the ground, and I'm worried the veins are too common.

DecaByte Should do, yes. 

RosstheGreat
The Stronger Sediments mod might help people that have issues with cave-ins?

SLEDGE_HAMMER I don't think so, the issue with that theory is that I should be able to recreate it on my machine readily, and the ore doesn't place in stone, it replaces stone. Also, I have a lot of checks and different functions to help prevent stones spawning in materials they shouldn't, and when they do they get a "Shell" of their host rock. 
I know for sure that it isn't the case. Unfortunately I think it's a load order issue, like a chunk not getting updated with my ore gen or something? I'm still not super sure on what causes it, and it's such a rare bug.

I think the invisible ore is because the deposits are spreading into the host rock that does not contain a texture for that mineral. Example no sulfur ore texture in andesite. Ive also noticed silver and lead droping from halite which doesnt contain a texture for those as well.

Permarin1 Well there goes that theory 😅 I have no idea what's causing it then. I can't get it on my machine but I haven't had time to test it multiple times.

_Ozymandias if you read down, there is a post where Ross replyed to me, explaining some of the possible ore gen shapes. There is no 100% on the shape, there is some randomness to it. 

RosstheGreat

my rig is:

Didn't this mod page have a chart showing all the details about every type of ore? Did you move it somewhere else?

Freeflier The only thing I change is how frequently ores spawn (Reduction) and the shape in which they spawn in. Wiki should still be pretty much accurate on it all.

I've added this mod to my latest playthrough and played through a year in-game, and I do like it so far. I have found that since ore nuggets spawn around nearby ore, you can gather a *ton* of surface level nuggets really quickly. I'm not even set up for iron but I have two stacks of it XD Which could be good or bad, but I could see tailoring back the quantity of surface nuggets since there's so much more ore close to the surface with this mod. 

I do have a question though, generally speaking is the wiki info for ore distribution still ok to use? The two things I'm struggling to find are quartz and borax, which has really put me in a standstill for advancing. If the wiki isn't good to go off of (to see how and where ore spawns) it would be great if you could include that pertinent info here.

Permarin1 From the brief test I did earlier I was unable to recreate it, but I also had a few additional things installed that might have messed with the test. I really appreciate you sending me that info.

What's your rig quality? Broadly. Could it run, in theory, VR for instance? I'm curious if something to do with lower rig memory or load time might have somethign to do with it?

And no worries, I think broadly you're fine.

RosstheGreat

it was the entire ore vein that was invisible. i bombed out alot, crossing chunks. and only when relogging did the remaining ore become visible.

i do hope you can manage to recreate it. but i also do agree with your mod description

"It's not game breaking, sometimes it fixes itself in game (according to reports), often a relog will also fix it."

and

"personally I want to label this issue as Minor"

ofc. people.. reading.. in this day and age? naah lol.

but i did read the entire modpage before i got the mod. but by the time i actually found ghost ores ingame i had forgotten they where adressed as a bug on this modpage. 

still reported it here tho.. since IOG is the only oregen affecting mod in my pack (that i know affects ores atleast lol)

Permarin1 That's some insanely helpful information, thank you! I'll take a look into it and see if I can recreate it on my machine. This has been a longstanding issue with IOG that I've never once been able to create on my machine.

Also, you mentioned relogging fixed it. Was there any blocks within that vein that showed at all? I'm looking for something like chunk boundary issues where maybe I'm not initializing the vein correctly and it loads in a weird way?

RosstheGreat

first see this image.

yea, no matter what block i was looking at. it all was named stone. i even went into survival with a pickaxe, and the "stone block" dropped copper.

this world was created modded. i did not add any mod to a already made vanilla world.

i found it cuz i was flying around looking at world gen with terra prety + rivers mod. testing out the ram usage with that many mods too. i came across this massive snow/ice platoue mountain. on it was copper samples. earlier in the same save i stumbled upon some tin ore in rock. and used some ore bombs, wanted to see how large the vein was. so when i found the copper i wanted to test that too. i dug strait down and didnt see any ore. i take out a propick and i get HUGE readings. but i see nothing. i enter flight + noclip in creative and poke random holes all around. still HUGE readings, no ore. thats when i take out some rock bombs. and to my suprise.. COPPER!? but only as items on the ground. 

before i posted the first comment, i updated from vs 1.20.12 to 1.21.5, i also deleted fully the mods folder, modsconfig folder and the cache folder. then i installed all the mods that i was using in 1.20.12, but fresh and for 1.21.X

i created 3 worlds prior to making this ghost ores world so that all the mod configs would be created.

i made a mega file share thing. so you can get the world, mods and configs to test it. (and here is the obligatory "internet stanger danger" use viritual machine or something if youre afraid of malware)

this is the world seed, world settings and cords of the copper location. and under is my modlist.

modlist: (mega link has a download w/ configs)

Permarin1 Ghost Ores! So you're telling me it didn't appear in Block Overlay? or did you just happen across it?
Is this a world updated from vanilla ore generation to use IOG later on?

This is, the single most annoying, rare, and hard to track down bug I've had to date! So all info you can provide me is huge! If possible, send me your world file and as much information about your world as possible.

hello RosstheGreat

found a visual bug of some sort..?

flying around in creative testing some stuff. came across a copper surface sample. wanted to see how big the vein was using this mod.

i look underground for a LONG time. find nothing. then i use a bomb. and somehow the andesite stone is dropping copper?

imgur showing it here:

earlier in the same save i found tin, and i could see the ore fine.

additional note. i am kinda running 196 mods, but out of those only this one affects anything with ores.

if you need a list i will provide it.

ill keep the worldfile incase you want all the details and cords to the invisible copper. but idk if you need it?

Teagan Yeah I saw, it changes vanilla ore placement so it isn't functionally compatible with IOG, just because IOG has it's own ore generation JSONS. 

Ores-a-plenty increases the chance ore will spawn in a chunk. That is it. The author has separate json files for several ores to achieve this

Lucian_Fallen Honestly I'd never heard or seen Ores-A-Plenty mod honestly. Any of the ores added by it will not work with IOG's generation, but they shouldn't be directly incompatible. Just not supported.

I'm not sure anyone asked this but, is this mod compatible with Ores-A-Plenty Mod ?

I gotta say this is very OP mod, omega ores don't seem to be rare at all. W mod.

Default generation likes to make stepping plateaus, which have tiny overhangs that collapse when a block is mined meters away, bringing a bunch of what should be stable rock down with it. The mechanic to collapse blocks with up to zero % instability from an epicenter does not work as intended in this and many other potential examples. The initial search function causes issues, as well as the epicenter function removing spheres of blocks where it doesn't make any sense, such as cliffsides.

The new cave-in mechanic is preventing me from drilling into a cliff face at all due to the search function causing mass destruction, and countless other performance-heavy random pits are being formed anywhere I want to dig, even dirt, causing a cave below to collapse, ruining my landscape. I love the ore generation, but please keep the cave-in features in a separate mod. For example, trying to sample one block from a cliffside, and a massive sphere of rock falls out of the side.

Thorin48 Spawnrate config isn't possible with the current setup. That's something situated within the vanilla game, best I could do is make ore more rare but honestly it's pretty rare as is. What happens is the ores follow oremap, and multiply their spawnrate in that specific region a LOT. So you can find absolutely no ore in a region, or find all the ore in a region. This is because of Vanilla Oremap.

also, bits are a holdover until I can finish making the dozens of assets I need to make for indicators of ore. They'll be removed eventually.

Also can you make it so that the bits spawned above them can be disabled for multiplayer I love the mod. However I want a hardcore play though is all thank you 

Can you add a config to this, the amount of ore veins on a 20% ore gen world is insane and I dont think its working has intended. In a 1500 block radius there was 10 copper viens 4 iron viens and 3 tin veins. I want to be able to get the ore to spawn very rarely. Thank you :)

Rythillian That's really interesting and kind of concerning. I never noticed much an issue on worldgen load? It does increase it by some but not by a significant amount. I've not had much issue on my end of things, or any of my clients on my server. 

What version of IOG were you running, and if you were testing did you have *any* other installed mods when doing so? Cleared Cache between tests, etc?

RosstheGreat We were just testing the mod's individually when we noticied the slowdown. Remove the mod and instantly the world loaded signifacntly faster. Was definitely more than 10-30% slower for some reason. Like we could run to the border of generation and had to wait for new chunks, vs without where the entire area generates in seconds.

Rythillian I have noticed a slowdown in worldgen but it shouldn't be more than, maybe 10-30% slower than before? Anything more than that might be cause for concern. What modlist are you running?

Cool mod but with it installed the world gen is insanely slow. Is there something I'm doing wrong?

MagnaFM Yes it should be perfectly fine to set up now and update later. Worst case ore veins will shift in shape or size but overall nothing you'd ever notice. (I don't plan on messing with them anytime soon but it's possible)
Other than that, yes.

MythOceanas Ah I love TP, we use it on my personal server too. Lovely terrain! And I really appreciate you mentioning Pickbars, that saved probably 2+ weeks of devtime on something similar. 😄

RosstheGreat yeah a cheap flag block is all I have been looking for. Even colored dirt works for what I am doing if it contrasts the terrain.

I am playing with Terra Prety at recommended settings so my world hight is pretty high. So I was curious about the shapes so i would be able to gage prospect mining holes when Im trying to hit a vein. So far its been working well except all the Quartz spanws right against the coast so I have to tunel down and under the ocean which is fun 😄 lots of slow careful tunneling. 

I just read that a lot of people had cave in issues, and wanted to hopefully help them out with the Pickbar thing.
 

Would this mod be safe to create a server with and then update if you're only fixing how cave ins work?

MythOceanas Survey flags would be huge, I'll add that to my list but i'm not sure if i'll ever add anything other than just a super cheap "Flag" form block to mark out ores. Probably no string or connectivity or anything though.

Ah, I specifically left out the list of which ores generate in what material. It's a lot to maintain because a lot of the old information on it was wrong. If you want a "live up to date" info on them, check my mod's deposit JSONs, otherwise I sort of leave it up to the players to figure it out.

To give a short list off the top of my head, and to echo what you mentioned:
Native Copper - Chimney AND fault
Iron forms in all types of shapes, depending on which iron you find. I believe Limonite is Hydrotube, Magnetite is Chimeny and Hematite is Fault. Not certain on Magnetite.
Lead is likely to be Chimneys and/or Hydrotubes, but I don't honestly recall
Zinc is Hydrotubes and Chimneys (I believe both)
All coals spawn in Fault vein types, same with Quartz, Gold, Silver, and Peridotite, among others.
Tin should spawn almost always as a Chimney formation, I don't think I ever gave it any others.
Malachite (My favorite) spawns as Hydrotube Deposits, but they tend to be significantly larger than other similar shaped ones with WAY more branches and longer tubes themselves. (You can see an example of it in the mod pictures at the very top)

If it's actually a significant issue I can write some sort of Handbook entry or maybe a list on the DB page for them, but it was easier for me to remove them and just sort of let people discover them as they so pleased. I have enjoyed forgetting which ores spawn in which veins only to rediscover them later when I go a-searching for it. 😁

RosstheGreat if you are looking for something to go with this I have not seen, it would be survey flags. Just a small stick with a color'd flag or string on it so you can kind of mark out where you find ore abaove ground and get an idea of the ore path bellow ground. I current use the map and a few fence posts but the fence posts can be hard to see without a bright colored flag.

Also, could you add a list to the mod page on the shapes ore is supposed to generate in? From what you posted above adn what I have seen, I am guessing from my seed, Copper, Lead and Iron are Chimney formations, Quartz, Gold, Silver, is in random disc and Zinc forms in Shutes. Coal and Anthicite I think are Chutes and Lead is Chimney. What shaped should Tin spawn in? It's been really hard to find it, except for a few small surface deposits.   

MythOceanas Yeah that is actually an incredible addition to my pack! I remember seeing the mod briefly when it first released but I was on break so I forgot about it. Thank you so much for referring it! I added a small recommended modlist section for both Post and Beams, and Pickbars. 😄

@RosstheGreat hopefully it will be good for both of you. Pickbars isn't really usefull for Vanilla Cave-ins but I saw it when I was setting up my pack around your mod and I have been happy with it.

MythOceanas

Oh no way! I'd never heard of Pick Bars mod! I had been debating adding it myself of some form or another but that solves that issue! 😄

I'm super happy to hear you're enjoying it! I'm not entirely sure what I would do differently than that mod, by the looks of it, it seems pretty much identical to what I wanted. Glad I added that sound queue! 

I have been combining this mod with the Pick Bar mod. It has really helped with setting up supports for caveins. I think a Pickbar type item should come with this mod because even with it, I occassionally have to seach to find a weak spot when I hear the rubbling. 

Really enjoy the mod 👍

RedXtreme Hey! Appreciate looking into IOG. To explain, I seem to have an issue somewhere in my code with my config that makes it not sync between client and server, among a few other minor things. Problem is it was all working before I published 2.0.0 but I apparently forgot to save it and now it's a complete mess. 🤕

It's been a slow process, like untangling the worst dense ball of headset chord you'd ever seen. I'd say it could take up to a week but I'm hoping it will only take today to fix the config. And, no worries on speeding up the process it's literally just a limitation of my available free time. Unless you're willing to pay my wages for a day 😂(This is a joke, do not do that). I can release a version with cave-in logic disabled completely if you need it today, or you can wait for the config which could be some time, as it's also going to come alongside some changes to cave-in logic. Although likely unapplicable on your server, if it has that many people on it.

Dear author! I own a server with a relatively large community. I'm currently preparing a build for the update from 1.20 to 1.21 and decided to use your ore generation mod.

Now, two days into beta testing, players are more concerned about your cave-in mechanics than they are excited about the new ore generation. This mechanic is unplayable for the server and for most players. Any attempt at geological exploration and mining results in colossal cave-ins in nearby caves, which puts a significant load on the server. We can't disable cave-ins completely, as that would turn into regular Minecraft.

Please tell me, is there an approximate time it will take to add a config to disable the mod's cave-ins? Is there a way to speed up this process, or could you release a version with the cave-ins removed? We're willing to sponsor this if it can speed up the process. Thank you!

V7I Hey! so you can turn off the Cave In logic by disabling cave-ins in the world config. For now it's not able to be seperately disabled so it's either my cave-in logic or no cave-in logic. This will change in the future, but it wont be immediate.

Further, the cave-ins happening far away I'm not really sure what to tell you, I would recommend being on the most up to date version, it should reduce the distance in which cave-ins can trigger by a bit. Newer version also reduces the frequency in which the cave knocking plays.

As for seperating the mods, yeah eventually I might pull the cave-in logic out for it's own mod. It will certainly have a config in the future for all of the fun settings you could want but unfortunately at the moment my config is bugged and currently disabled. This will be fixed in the future, but again it wont be for a while yet.

is there a way to disable all the "Cave In Logic" stuff?? 
im getting really annoyed by the sounds and the caveins even when i suport the cave. . . 

also cave in happening 20+ blocks away because i broke a block somewhere else is very annoying and confusing. . 

i LOVE the new ore gen but not everything else?

like. . . why? 
at the very least let us disable that stuff, at best i would like them split into 2 diffrent mods? 

RosstheGreat I just wanted to let the other guy know that is isn't per se wrong what he said. In the end it's up to you what you do and certainly it is more punishing than the arguably not very well fleshed out cave in vanilla mechanic (i'd have to lie but for every preset it's turned off)

Kaschperle You’re right that the cave-in logic isn’t flawless, there are edge cases where it feels a bit off. That said, it’s working as intended, and I’m not planning to refactor it again right now (maybe down the line, but not anytime soon). This mod is meant to be a tougher, less forgiving take on cave-ins and mining in general, so if that doesn’t sit right, disrespectfully don't use my mod.

As for “not ready to be live” — let’s be real: there will never be a “perfect” system. Technical limits (and my own skill and performance constraints) mean there are always tradeoffs. And even if I somehow shipped a flawless version, I’m sure someone would still find a way to complain about it.

RosstheGreat so I did also some testing the cave in logic is sometimes silly if I destroy  a rock which is below me not supporting anything it will bring the ceelling down. I knew there was this cracked 100% instability rock but the logic doesn't sit right with that one. If I destroyed the stone to the side or half I would have understood but you can trigger a cave in if its in the radius of a 100% instability stone. So there is still to work on. So I fully agree CharlieSoulfire that your cave in logic is broken. You can say "use support beams" yet I say if vanilla cave gen makes a cave like this it should be stable enough. As long you dont dig up. But triggering a cave in from destroying the ground is a flawed mechanic and not ready to be live

Algernon Hey that's awesome! Glad to hear I wasn't crazy on my logic in the cave-ins. 😅

What do you think of the mechanics overall so far?

Tested the cave-in and cave interactions a bit after seeing people comment something along the lines of it being possible to get killed by digging into a cave.

I found that if you're doing support beams right its actually impossible to get caved in, no matter how you dig into a cave, which is how it should be imo.

Usedtea No, not at the moment. Unfortunately it makes it nearly impossible to fix a cave-in if it's not turned to gravel. Sorry to hear you dislike the idea of it being cleanable with your bare hands, although it would still take quite some time regardless. It also begs the addition of a shovel into your mines which is nice to add more tooling desired for mining. 

Is there any way to make fallen stone turn into cracked stone? I don't really like the idea of being able to clean up a cave-in with your bare hands.

Kaschperle Yeah I could but I'd also need to rename the file so people don't see something like "Interesting Underground", go to remove, or update it or something and not find the file they're looking for. If I rename the file I also need to rename all of my variables, asset folder, and a bunch of other stuff.

In short, it wont be happening.

RosstheGreat isn't it enough just to rename the moddb page? Don't have to touch your files for the title I think.

Kaschperle Renaming it has similar issues, IOG is fine as is. Mainly because internally there's a bunch of code I would need to rename too and honestly I just can't be bothered like I said. One day I may rip out all of the Non-ore gen stuff but for now it remains because it's easier for me to patch and manage the project as a whole as opposed to 2 different projects so closely linked.

RosstheGreat yeah forgot that I turned down the whole gen chances and made them smaller lmao. I mean it's your mod but you should rename it then. As interesting ore gen only means generation. Mining overhaul Ore Mining Overhaul. As that would reliable showcase it's not just a gen mod. "Immersive Ore extraction" 

Kaschperle Pretty accurate, if you mine similar to vanilla but with just a bit of roof reinforcement it's normally fine. Also explosions don't cause my cave ins, that is on purpose for the Drilling and Blasting. 😄

As for a seperate version, if someone doesn't want to play with my cave-ins they'd need to turn them off in worldgen, but I wont seperate them for now for 2 main reasons:

1) It's meant to be the added "Difficulty" of having such huge ore veins with ample supply of ore. Too many complaints of it making the game "too easy" so it will remain. Just to spite them 😁

2) It's a total ballache to seperate the code, set up a new mod, integrate, test and fix anything that needs it, AND set up a whole other modpage, image, etc. all of that setup for a mod that I'll need to also maintain alongside IOG. One day, sure I'll probably rip it out and slap another mod on the DB but for now I cannot be bothered.

to voucher for RosstheGreat from my own experience it's similar to vanilla cave ins I removed the knocking sfx as it was so annoying to hear it every 15 sec. So far I haven't died to cave ins and only had controlled ones. I used none beams method like 2x2 in andesite stone and 3x3 should work too. Never dig up if its to unstable same rule for vanilla cave ins. Did explosions in a silver quarz vein and only near the explosive parts it came down. So far I can't tell any difference tbh to vanilla cave ins. If I have a arch it will never fall down but a flat rock line is dangerous and you should only use it with beams that kind of mining. I am also using salty's cave symphony which also adds random earthquakes and triggers some blocks falling

But I understand that CharlieSoulfire believes it's one or another perhaps making a seperate version where only the ore gen is included wouldnt hurt. 

CharlieSoulfire The cave-in mechanics are working exactly as intended. If your tunnels collapse despite what you think are proper supports, that’s… on you. This isn’t a bug, it’s skill—surprise! I’ve mined every type of stone on my private server using reinforced or natural supports, and it works flawlessly. Cave-ins are meant to be a challenge; if that’s too much, maybe this mod isn’t for you. I make it for myself, not to cater to complaints that read more like whining, and I won’t be responding to any further messages from you. Figure it out and move on.

You cannot prevent the majority of cave-ins by supporting your mine or cave. I supported every other block with the posts from the posts mod you suggested and still had random, unpredictable collapses. I have even tried holding the ceiling up with other solid blocks and the cave-in just goes through the block and being supported from beneath had no bearing on the fact the center of the collapsed circle was (when checking in spectate) on a block which was 0% unstable before the cave-in (since I have to obsessively check every wall and ceiling block to see if there is any instability at all to delay the inevitable I know this block was completely stable). There is no skill issue when literally nothing prevents cave-ins with this mod.

You either have a mod which turns natural caves off or makes them scarce if you think it is at all possible to venture underground while avoiding being with 10 blocks of a cave (which will always contain completely unsupported blocks). Expanding on my complaint about the cave-in warning (which I try to use to avoid being near caves) it only seems to play from some 100% unstable blocks, not all. So even if it was possible to relyably locate through sound queues (instead of having every other sound drowned out by an omnipresecent series of thumps), this would not catch every case where, for example, a very small natural void silently ruins your day. So, even when I am making sure every block visible is 0% unstable, I still have chained collapses.

As mentioned, I am using the mod you suggested. This still did not help. I mentioned it several times in the comments you chose to sardonically mock. I installed it at the same time as your mod since I waited to start a world until I had your initial feedback since I had expected you to make a suggestion of the sort. Here is a direct suggestion: link that other mod in this mod's description where referring to the cave-in mechanic if you consider it such a cornerstone of the experience. I am surprised you don't already do so. I would also suggest redacting the blurb about there being a configuration file until such a time that there is once more an attempt to implement customization options.

Caves are already impossible to cave in when using this mod since you need several stacks of support posts to ensure all blocks are supported before trying to extract resources in a small area and even then (see above) you can have all that effort ruined by a block you couldn't see. Needing this many inventory slots pre-occupied to even try extracting resources is one of the reasons I mainly quarried in TFG when I found ores, it was typically not worthwhile to try to support a series of tunnels when the game equally rewards avoiding the problem altogether and, in fact, punishes attempts to use or learn the included collapses system by destroying resource nodes. The system also cannot account, neither here nor there, for trying to follow a resource vein which slants upwards from where it was initally discovered, as the suggested here and included there beams do not grant requisite support when trying to carefully slant a mineshaft toward the higher altitude resource branch.

I am allowed to complain when systems are hostile and give no feedback. In fact, if you can't see the over-arching theme of how I want the ability to more accurately tell which areas are effectively bombs which cause catastrophic chained failures and an unrecoverable mess of a mine (or, in my case as well, burying my hobbit-home halfway through construction unexpectedly) when triggered, you may not have been actually reading my complaints and instead only skimming them to see ways to be sardonic and hostile (also hinted towards by the fact you missed how I am, in fact, using the posts mod you suggested when I mentioned it several times). I would have just said "bad mod," uninstalled, and moved on, rather than trying to use the mod (as shown in the timeline of me returning to add more comments over the course of a day as I encountered behaviors the mod caused) and leaving long, detailed comments. I like the mod, and want it to improve, but I am not a developer for this kind of project so the best I can do is tell you how behaviors of the mod feel as a user (similarly to how telling a doctor your symptoms helps them diagnose the problem, you don't typically walk in and tell the doctor what to treat you for unless you have a very good idea what it is, and even then you may be very wrong). I despise the very new and very backwards but somehow popular idea that you can't take issue with something you, yourself, do not know how to fix. I'll admit I don't have any solid suggestions for what to implement, since I do not know what really is possible to implement and suggesting, say, that blocks which are crucial support be marked as such in their tooltip, may be suggesting the impossible and a worthless thing to do. Just having an indicator that "mining this block will cause a collapse" when a block is adjacent enough to a 100% unstable block would solve most of my complaints, most likely.

RE: "Also:" If mining a block causes a collapse, was it stable in a classic sense? Probably. But as an end user it doesn't feel very good when I am mining a block directly adjacent to a support post (in a place lined with support posts and other forms of support) and a catastrophic chain reaction happens when the UI, combined with the small forest invested into the very small escavation area in the form of posts, would suggest safety. I have also mined a 0% unstable stone on the surface and heard catastrophic chain reactions go off below me, in another case where "removing support" is a non-factor. I agree with the idea that mining a wall which is holding up the block above you should cause a collapse, but the feedback for what blocks are doing that is key to a smooth experience. The implementation definitely makes it so many collapses in human-made mines do not at all feel like human error and instead an act of Dave. I don't even think the system feeling so counterintuitive was your intention, but when using the mod yourself you are coming from a place of absolute knowledge and likely assuming a similar amount of knowledge when remarking on my complaints, when the documentation in the very description of the mod contradicts what you have asserted in your response to me. "Breaking a block will trigger a 'Search' event that will find a block within 12 blocks of the player that is 100% unstable." and "A cavein requires a block with 100% instability to actually start scanned in a 10 block radius," directly contradict one another, when both pieces of information come directly from you. Even in the event that it actually is only 1k blocks checked (assuming a 10x10x10 cube) rather than (12x12x12 cube) of roughly 1.7k, that is a very large amount of blocks which are not visible to the player which can cause the roof to fall on them repeatedly when breaking a single, seemingly safe, block.

Update 2.0.2!

-Significantly reduced frequency of knocking and rumbling sounds (5-15 minutes between scans)

-Reduced radius of secondary cave-in search radius by half (down to 10 blocks)

-Reduced radius of Primary cave-in search radius (down to 10 blocks)

-Changed secondary cave-ins to only trigger epicenters on blocks with 100% instability

-Patch out vanilla cave-in logic for placing blocks

-Changed it so when stone blocks collapse, they turn into gravel instead of cracked stone!

Experimented with different cave-in logic, for now it was deemed to be unnecessary but I might experiment adding them further.

CharlieSoulfire Hahah. That is an awful lot of assumptions based on very little.
First, you can completely prevent the vast majority of a cave-in by properly supporting your mine or cave. I attribute this to skill issue.

Second, A cavein requires a block with 100% instability to actually start scanned in a 10 block radius, and from there a scan is performed at random selecting 2 blocks (MAXIMUM) to be secondary epicenters (20 block maximum, tuned down in next update), that are a minimum of 80% instability or more. However from those epicenters (Both primary and secondary), it will collapse any block within it's determined radius. (4 block radius maximum for Primary, and 2 block radius maximum for secondary). If you support your mines correctly and no block is above 80% instability you wont have any collapses. (Keep in mind collapses aren't spheres either, they're deformed ellipsoids and on occasion cones)

Third, Vanilla reinforcement (support beams) are wonky. They only support from the very first part placed and nowhere else along the beam's length or other end. This is something I might tackle fixing eventually but I have other priorities first. Use Post and Beams, it supports things almost Identically to TFC and is in fact much easier to manage.

Fourth, TerraFirmaCraft for the longest time didn't actually reinforce caves naturally. There wasn't the "Hardened Stone" you see today that lined the roof of caves. I have looked into it but with the current implementation of support logic (a vanilla feature I piggyback off of to implement my cave-in mechanics) it isn't possible without making caves unable to be caved in at all. Which goes outside of my design goals, therefore will not be added.

Fifth and most importantly, instead of bitching and whining at me about how hard I made things, give me actual suggestions in how to improve the system. I'm happy to hear suggestions, but if the only thing you're going to do is complain, don't use my mod.

Also:

"Breaking a completely stable block should never encase you, ever." (From one of your comments)

I fundamentally disagree with this. If you're mining into a wall and the wall maintains 0% instability, but you're removing a support structure to the ceiling? Yes. It should collapse on you.

The problem is that at least in TFG, you can ensure you do not cause a cave-in by reinforcing any block you mine. Here it triggers in a genuinely massive radius. (12 blocks in each direction? isn't that up to over 1.7k blocks in a cube around your interaction it checks which can naturally spawn unstable and unreachable and therefore not the player's fault?) So you can't even feel like you, yourself, caused a cave-in and just resign that the system is massively overtuned and hostile rather than being something you can work around and therefore a bump in difficulty. It's not like you even get proper feedback on what unreachable block destroyed your careful workmanship, you just have to hope you've not hit a mine in a game of minesweeper without any numbers.

RedXtreme Vanilla cave-in mechanics are trivial, if you mine every block from the top-down it never causes a collapse (I have mined 100x100 rooms before by just mining from the top block down in Vanilla), so I disagree. However, when I get around to fixing up the config and making it work yes I will add a way to change or possibly disable my cave in mechanics. It will be a good while before that's implemented as I'm still tweaking the logic for it still.

I also plan on changing the sounds frequency a bit, they should be significantly less common next update. If you want to remove them now, unzip the mod and remove them yourself in the sounds folder.

RosstheGreat Dear autor!
I'm very impressed with the ore generation your mod provides. It's literally what I've been looking for for a long time, because vanilla ore generation is complete crap. However, with version 2.0.0, you added a massive cave-in mechanic that can't be disabled! The vanilla cave-in mechanic was more than enough to make gameplay more challenging, it was already quite enjoyable without any modifications. Please, can you make an option to completely disable your cave-in mechanics and the scary knocking over-amp sounds in caves? I just only want your awesome ore veins generation!
Thank you for your work!

qlVegetalp That's really odd, and I don't think anything to do with IOG. I'm really not sure what to do about that, sorry. If you do discover the issue let me know!

ShadowStormCZ Yes I agree with clearing rubble being a pain. I'm looking into changing cave-in block drops into Gravel or another "custom" block perhaps so you can actually clear the debris without further triggering cave-ins. It is silly. I'm also looking into reducing the radius for primary and secondary cave-in epicenter searches a bit. Also for the breaking blocks on the ground, I've had the idea of possibly looking into making a mechanic where if you change nearby instability in blocks that's when cave-ins can trigger. So mining blocks on the ground wouldn't trigger them as long as no blocks nearby have a change in instability. However when mining wall portions it can trigger them. Also might completely aleviate the rubble issue but who knows.

CharlieSoulfire I'm almost happy that I've made someone crash out from my mod. Hah! It would appear you might be familiar with the minecraft mod TerraFirmaCraft (what TerraFirmaGreg was based on). That is precisely my inspiration for the cave-in mechanic, it was well done and logical for the most part.

As for the one real thing you actively gave me for constructive criticism, I'm not really sure how to change the sounds to be less annoying other than removing them entirely, which you can freely do yourself. I'll tune down their frequency though to be far far more rare, but be sure to check every block nearby for instability.

I love the idea of big cave-ins, don't get me wrong. Your whole mineshaft collapsing and burying you alive is TERRIFYING, I love it. But I can break a single block on the ground in a cave, and the whole ceiling collapses! That's too much. And if you clear the rubble, even more cave-in happen. That's ridiculous... 

Listening out for knocking does nothing for you since you can't safely get to it to solve it while mining. That is, if you can tell where the 120 decibel racket is coming from since it is oppressively loud which means you can't find it with spatial audio. Reinforcing does nothing for you since your blocks can collapse while directly reinforced. The only safe way to mine would be to strip mine so there is nothing to fall on you, and even then half your ore would be gone by the time you get to it since natural caves are made of gunpowder-soaked tissue paper and explode the moment you get remotely close to them.

It is actually infurating to have the game grief you this hard. It's as bad as malicious devs like BetterThanWolves and RLCraft where resource gathering is actively punished. Breaking a completely stable block should never encase you, ever. It's backwards, nonsensical, and contibutes nothing to the gameplay loop. There is often no feedback at all before you get griefed hard and have no way out of the situation, as trying to escape just griefs you even more. I've come to the conclusion that the cave-ins are genuinely terrible.

You try to clear what fell on you to add supports? Out of luck, chain reaction. Get crushed. You manage to find all the blocks making the annoying "I'm gonna fall on you" sounds? Tough luck, only some blocks made sounds and cave-is cause hidden voids you can't get to without triggering a cave-in. You place blocks under the stone to create something for them to sit on? Doesn't work, the stone falls through your reinforcements and encases you.

It's actually painful to try to build within the earth with the chain reactions this mod causes, I have to add. Some hidden one block natural void you happen to be within the massive 12 block reaction radius can cause your whole building project to be ruined.

It was weird because it's a fresh server so no one has the tools to break stone it kinda just happens as we walk around like if something else is triggering it

Don't get me wrong, I adore the ore generation, but I feel like I am playing against the intentional hostile design of TerraFirmaGreg again when trying to avoid instability.

The cave-ins are definitely wayyyyy overtuned. I can mine a single stone block to start mining at the surface and cause four primary cave-ins. Mining a 0% unstable block shouldn't cause the ground to collapse under you, and most cave-ins happen when mining either an initial downwards shaft or when mining blocks at 0% instability supported by beams from the recommended companion mod. The instability even seems completely arbitrary, going so far as that I can have a block in direct contact with a support with 100% unstable. I basically spam a post under any block with any instability and hope there are no hidden blocks with instability high enough to cause my demise. Additionally, the constant cave sounds while walking on the surface in some areas get old very quickly since they seem to have a radius of 30 blocks where the sound is played.

Intriguing. What were people on the surface doing? I can't think of anything off the top of my head that could cause that unless one of your players was breaking stone blocks on the surface. qlVegetalp

We hear the knocking but I no clipped into the ground because we also then start to hear the collapsing sound and when I was in the ground a blocks just kept falling over and over like it started to make its own cave with how much it collapses 

qlVegetalp Is it a "knocking" sound effect? Something to the tune of like a cracking or echoed tapping underground? That would indicate weak stone. Otherwise if it's actual cave ins I have no idea, I have it programmed to only potentially trigger when players break unstable (stone) blocks. Nothing else.

idk why but cave ins are happening constantly even though no on is mining underground we just started fresh and hear constant collapses under me

CharlieSoulfire It changes it very little, if making it easier at current (with 2.0.X) as more surface nuggets can be found commonly. It also doesn't remove the vanilla surface bits or change that gameplay beyond making it slightly easier if you find a big copper deposit.

Underground is fun! Just make sure you listen to the knocking noises (they indicate unstable rock) and make sure to reinforce your mines! I highly recommend the Post and Beams mod as well to go along with it!

How much does this mod touch the journey from stone-age to copper age? The description says it turns off vanilla generation, which I know is split into two parts (deep deposits and surface deposits) where the latter is pretty important for getting access to the second. That is, if you don't want to spend an unreasonable amount of time gambling with cracked pots from ruins or checking traders for tools if you're lucky enough to get the gears you need. I'm open to the idea of needing to trade and scavenge into the metal age, but I need to set my expectations before jumping in.

The cave-ins system seems interesting and is something I am looking forwards to failing to adapt to when I do get my new world set up and get to the point of going underground ;)

LizardWizard999 Glad you're enjoying the mod overall! On the cave in logic, the idea is that removing material underground doesn't just affect the blocks you mine, but that it can destabilize nearby unsupported areas. Even if you weren't aware of the cave, it could still be structurally tied to the area you were working in. That said, I am still experimenting with it on my private server and will reduce it in the future if it proves to be too aggressive.

As for the cave audio, it isn't just ambience. It's actually a mechanic representing where unstable areas in the cave are (as they play directly from the block itself) and these areas are spots where you should look at reinforcing. The timing is already set to be a little longer than it was before, (10 seconds to 1 minute) but if it were much rarer we (my server) found that it was harder to notice instability before a collapse happens. I'll keep an eye on it to make sure it feels fair without being overwhelming but it's unlikely at current I will change it.

With all of that said, You can know if there are unstable areas nearby if your mine is reinforced and you hear knocking. That can (and normally does) indicate a cave or cavity where you should pay special or close attention to. Keep in mind no collapses can have an epicenter in blocks below 80% instability (for secondaries) and 100% instability (for primary epicenters) so reinforcing and supporting mines and caves shouldn't be too hard.

Cool mod, but I think the cave in logic is a bit illogical at times, maybe the 12 block search should be cut in half or something? My mineshaft collapsed a nearby cave that I didnt even realize was there and from a physics standpoint it really didnt make sense at all.

Also I really would suggest turning down the cave audio frequency, deleting them completely made the mod experience much better. The audio could be a nice touch if it was much much rarer.

stoicshield Ah, yeah that's a good point. I changed the description, I had honestly forgotten I mentioned a config there. Totally my bad 😅

As for how many nuggets there are, probably. However nuggets are a temporary addition anyway, more of a proof of concept for the eventual prospecting update with "Indicators" for veintypes. I'm not sure when that will be though as I need to create a ton of assets for it, and I'm honestly not looking forward to that.

Maybe remove the "and there is a config" hint in the "You can disable them, and there is a config" part of the red highlighted intro if there is actually no config file yet?

Once it works again though, as long as there are surface nuggets, will there be a method to tweak how many nuggets there are? I personally like the nuggets themselves, but there really are a lot :D

Metalsoul212 No config currently, if you want to disable the cave-in mechanics disable them in worldgen or use the command to change them on a live world.

I'd highly recommend the Posts and Beams mod as well by the way! It makes supporting mines much much easier.

Cant find the config for this mod. The cave-ins are insufferable. While digging you can cause a nearby cave to collapse repeatedly. So far everytime I dig a shaft to find ore I end up having to abandon the search because the nearby cave collapses make mining actually impossible.

Nico_Nico_Nyx At current no, they are a stand in for surface indicators, but they're rolled per ore placed. Tuning them down can make smaller veins impossible to find, so unfortunately with my current implementation no I can't reasonably turn them down, sorry.

In the future they wont be nuggets, but rather some form of surface indicators that become it's own minigame. 

Would it be possible to tone down the surface nuggets? I find it a bit ridiculous and kinda broken to have an entire plains full of iron bits on the surface, maybe a configurable option if that's possible any? ^^

Arcanum3000 Awesome! I vaguely remember learning something about that just before I got into VS. I used to play OLD TerrafirmaCraft back before they made all of their deposit shapes into spheres. Those were fun days.

Simori Rarity settings are borderline impossible from how I understand them. It's all JSON patches for the ores, and I don't *think* I can apply config data to them. Although it's something I can certainly look into later.

Bigoy The surface nuggets are supposed to be the new way you find the deposits, avoiding the Prospecting Pickaxe. Keep in mind these are a placeholder until I can implement the real "Indicators" feature. (For example plants that indicate particular oretypes) but that feature will be a long ways out still, I'm doing a playthrough currently to get my own feedback on what I want changed or added first so it'll be a good month or two at least.

Currently any form of config is broken(And removed) so it's not possible to remove or disable them without just removing IOG. 

creating a new world with this on 1.21.1 i spawn near a lot of surface ores, like there are more surface ore stones than regular stones; tin, chromium, copper, etc. i even have surface tin disabled in world gen settings and ore deposits at 60 percent, is it supposed to be like this?

I love the idea behind this mod as I always found the disc shape of ore generating very odd (and not only that since flowers do have this kind of behavior).

Think you can implement a rarity setting in the future? I personally find the frequency of these beautiful ore veins to be too common.

RosstheGreat Thanks, that's great!  Spawning being limited to realistic spawners is actually what I want!  There was a mod for Minecraft called OreVeins that did something very similar.  Made by a geologist.  I loved the idea, but it was abandoned years and years ago.  I was hoping this would bring the concept over to Vintage Story!

Arcanum3000 The ores are set to generate relatively realistically, but you're welcome to add patches or change them in the JSON for single player if you want them to all use all of the veintypes.
All ores do not spawn as all veintypes. For instance Native Copper only spawns as Fault and Chimney, Malachite only spawns as HydroTube. All vein types have spawners, but I don't have that information posted anywhere so people may discover it on their own. (I'm lazy and don't want to upkeep that data)

This looks interesting, but there's something I'm unclear about:  Are all ore types eligible to be generated in all the new formations, or are they restricted to the formations they'd appear in in the real world?

MageTrash
Glad it helped, although it should have only been an occasional log, nothing seriously taxing. I appreciate the comments! Prospect module is likely still a good couple months away at least. I'm doing a playthrough right now and when that's done I should have enough information for where I want to take the mod with prospecting.

Phew, thank you for removing the log spam! Definitely noticed way less lag/freezes on this vers.

Excited to see how you develop the prospick module.

Update:

Removed the Config, My original one didn't save and it was completely useless. (It didn't actually do anything)

Fixed cave in sounds playing when cave ins are disabled

Fixed the log spam (hopefully) and removed any errenious logs.

Increased the maximum time between cave-knocking noises from 30 seconds to 1 minute, with a minimum of 10 seconds

Stops scheduling search events if no player is online (for dedicated servers)

Fixed faults/seam veins having random grid locking

Config will come back at a later point in time with actual functioning features, but it will be a good while.

B0bb0 The debugger shouldn't have been on, but all of the checks it does are extremely lightweight, much less than any regular pathfinding check for entities, for example.

Also if you're hearing sounds the only way for them to play is on unstable blocks so it's likely there is a cave or pocket under you somewhere or nearby. The sound always originates from the actual unstable block. 🙂 I'm releasing an update shortly that should fix the stability sound feature playing when cave ins are turned off. That's my bad, my editor apparently didn't save when I was going to release 2.0.0 so all of my work for that didn't come through.


It's unlikely I'll seperate the sounds and stability feature into a different mod for quite a while, for a few different reasons but the biggest one is it's a lot of extra effort for me to deal with maintaining and updating 2 different projects constantly with such little time.

I'm with 4nric. Please give us a way to disable the stability feature.  Not just the sounds.  It appears to schedule a ton of checks too based on logs.  It is knocking and rattling on the surface with no cave in sight.  Perhaps all the stability and drilling/blasting could go into an "Interesting Mining" mod.  :)

Kaschperle Sure, I'd love to see the example pictures!
Use the IOG thread in the Official Vintage discord:
https://discord.com/channels/302152934249070593/1367581350118428794

RosstheGreat nono I just changed your radius etc all the ones who decide how big and how many branches a vein has has nothing tied to the surfaceonly bla bla rock thingy. :"D if your on the VS discord I could send you example pictures of the ore gen. But just number tweaking!

Kaschperle Totally fair, I play on a server and built the mod primarily for playing with groups on servers. I thought it was pretty well balanced for a "Vanilla" Style of gameplay progression/speed solo as well, although if you find that too fast that's also fair. That's why we play with mods, to tweak the game how we want! 😄

As for the vein, I'm not sure. Best I can tell you is, my code it doesn't use surfaceBlockChance whatsoever so it wont actually do anything. However I'm not sure why you would be seeing less ore for setting something like that either. 

RosstheGreat

I greatly had to reduce the vain sizes for a personal balance choice I also use a mod I did which reduces the ore drops to 1 per ore block. As I feel porgression is kinda to easy in this game. Then again I use salty's manual crushing which has 1 nugget for 1 poor ore chunk. Well I am not sure if it was vanilla gen as that one tin vain had the chimney transformation.

Kaschperle I'm positive ore frequency spawn rate isn't implemented in my ore generators, I use custom functions to spawn the surface nuggets. One limitation on the nugget spawn is that they only spawn on blocks with nothing on them (e.g. blocks with no grass, leaves, trees, etc. on them) so there might be some funnyness with that. (They will spawn under water though, so often it's easier to find them in ponds or lakes or rivers if you play with that)

Beyond that, the ore spawns aren't 100% balanced yet, but I'm so far fairly happy with how they are so far. Hence my suggestion for reducing global spawn frequency to 20%, overall will make ores spawn significantly less frequently.

Also, note on the surface veins for stuff like copper and tin from vanilla, I had forgotten to patch them out to be honest 😅 In my current server we reached mining copper ore with one pickaxe (and had enough ore just from picking up stuff off of the ground to make ourselves an anvil, saw, axe, and scythe). It certainly changes progression a little bit, but honestly I don't think it changes it too terribly much. Especially if I remove the vanilla surface deposits, considering in ~6 hours of gameplay from 4 people each, we've found 2 of the "big" copper deposits in a ~2000 block area.

RosstheGreat but it seems to be working on my end? hmh weird.

EDIT your right. some do work apparently with chance tho for example magnanese, lead and zinc.

A bandaid fix for people would be to make the surface spawn veins with the option a lot more rarer and that would kind of fix that too as most have 2-3 generation forms

Sky_StarBlade That's some wild luck then, in the 15 or so worlds I generated for testing I found surface nuggets at spawn maybe 3 or 4 times and only once to the degree you mention. I shouldn't really change the frequency of nugget generation because I'm finding in my current server playthrough, while the initial jump to progression isn't bad the mining is really what slows things down with supports and whatnot. We also use Salty's Immersive Mining (Highly recommend for a more "Balanced" experience with IOG) and it's helped make the nuggets feel less OP.
I would recommend if you're getting too many at spawn, turn your Ore Deposit Frequency down to 20-40% because that will make ore veins more rare. but, from what I've seen myself it seems like you've gotten quite lucky 😅

Kleber All good! I understand, following the chimney or hydrotube veins is also a great time. I am sorry I wont be able to add the ability to remove them but if you want, you could go in and make a patch for IOG that removes fault veins from the generation in the JSONs. It wouldn't be too hard, just make sure you set the correct variables for the new veins. If you need or want help with that feel free to contact me and I can help you through it. 😄

Lanthanide I appreciate it! and as for the prospecting not really. There is ways to fix it but honestly that just doesn't align with my goals for this mod not using the prospecting pickaxe. Also the prospecting pick Node seach should work just fine with IOG, it's a direct scan of nearby blocks so I don't see why it wouldn't? The Density search mode is what will end up giving a lot of false positives, and frankly that's because vanilla prospecting is built for vanilla ores. I'm planning on reworking the prospecting as is (you can read more about that in the IOG Thread on the official Vintage Story discord) but for now no, I will not be fixing the prospecting pickaxe's Density Search Mode.

4nric Like Kashperle said unpackage the zip file, go in and delete the audio files. Sorry about the config, I had it all layed out to allow people to pick and choose what they wanted but unfortunately it appears when I went to publish the mod I forgot to save it and didn't end up getting it into the final build. I will likely be fixing that here in a few days hopefully.  In the meantime feel free to delete the audio files on the client's side.

Kaschperle surfaceBlockChance isn't a function recognized by my ore gen unfortunately. This is on purpose for the time being, as eventually it will have to hard spawn these objects as opposed to "Suggestively with a hardcoded % chance". Best I can suggest if someone does need to reduce them is to either remove them, or decrease the surface deposit frequency at worldgen.

4nric just delete the audio files

Sky_StarBlade just go into mineralore / metalore of the mod and change the surface

"surfaceBlock": { "code": "looseores-limonite-{rock}-free" },

either delete it or add a chance to it.

"surfaceBlockChance": 0.001,

Love the mod and the idea, but we had to uninstall it cause the mineknocking.ogg and fallingdebris is playing all the time, it would be nice if you add an option to disable some sounds cause we loved the gameplay but hated the sound additions

Hey I really enjoy your work that's why I have couple questions, do you think vanilla prospecting is fixable to work well with your mod or you need to implement workarounds? I had experienced many instances of ore veins spawning nowhere near "high or "very high" ore readings or even mostly in places where there's no ore detected of the type I found. Node search is also broken since it's based off vanilla ore gen if I'm correct. (IT WORKS FINE I WAS JUST DUMB, I misunderstood what the readings mean). I haven't tried 2.0.0 because I can't update my world but do the ore bits mentioned in the latest update spawn on top of the large modded veins? Even non surface copper?

proximity prospecting and absolute prospecting mods work fine, only vanilla density search gives false positives.

RosstheGreat Hey Thanks for explaining, dont worry about the fault veins its just a Pesonal preference that i like this kind of Tunnel Mining more and when u hit a fault vein u sit there and have to dig out a horizental disk that throws my head off a bit😀

RosstheGreat The ore bits on the surface can be somewhat progression breaking. I've been finding black coal, iron, copper, etc. bits everywhere after just loading up a fresh world. Within 5 minutes I had enough copper for a few tools, not to meantion all the iron, silver, & coal I was leaving behind since I didn't even have reed hand baskets yet.

If you could manipulate how frequent ore bits spawn above veins then it wouldn't be a problem IMO. Like maybe over 500% less or something. Not sure on the exact numbers, but I know that currently surface metal bits are more common than food. lol

Patahto I can look into it but right now it's being tied to a few too many internal systems to rip out yet. I'd suggest attempting an upgrade, just make sure you copy your world first and store it safely! I personally haven't actually tried upgrading old worlds so I don't know if anything breaks, but I didn't test hence the warning.


Kleber Disabling certain generation types would be extremely difficult because each ore is manually assigned them like vanilla ore. They are JSON patched in to use the new generators, and quite a lot of the info comes from them. In short, it would be far too much work to just disable one or two generators and have ores generate from another generator.
Sorry to hear you don't like the fault veins! They're some of my favorite so far, is there anything I can do or change with them to make them more interesting perhaps?

(Also it would appear the config I finished transferred to the new build didn't actually transfer! That's frustrating, there's a bunch of sound and cave-in settings that simply don't show up! Should be fixed in the next build, hopefully.)

would it be possible to have the modified cave-in logic be released as a standalone mod? for example for those who already have a world with pre-2.0 IOG and can't really update without starting a new world.

Any Possibility to get Options in the Config for disabling certain Generation Shapes? i Personally dont like Fault Veins for example and i think it would be a cool addition if we could Config this.

also currently the Config only has "OreDensityMultiplier": 1.0 for me, is this correct? does this scale how big the Veins are or how Frequently they appear?

0ddity_Gaming Yes hah. I am aware of that, It's in my to do list for next update.

RosstheGreat something I've noticed is that it will play the collapsing sounds even when collapsing is not turned on, so if you have cave-ins turned off, you run into the issue of Debris and Knock playing CONSTANTLY. (I'm part of a mod team on a server... we spent two hours trying to find out why our caves were horrifying. We play without cave-ins. It was this mod causing the issue.)

DoktorVanBarron At current, not a direct toggle. I just forgot to add one to the config hahah. I balanced the new ores around the difficulty that is made with the new collapse logic. 

You can probably fiddle with the configs to get something less harsh than what's there, I actually made it a lot more forgiving than I had initially planned.

I will look at adding that next update, I'm still waiting on any further bug reports before I update anything. I will make note of this though 😅 Next update should be in a week maybe, unless something game breaking ends up happening.

If you don't want cave ins as well, you can simply disable them at world gen, you'll get spooky noises but no collapses will happen. 

Is there a toggle to the Modified Collapse Logic?
trying to perruade someone I know to try this out, but they're very much "I don't want to change too much"

Werka I will eventually update the mod to say 1.21 but it works as is right now.

Will there be an update to the new version 1.21?

Hello @RosstheGreat it's good the mods work for me in 1.21 it came from a conflict in the name of the file that I had in 2 times I am talking about the (2).zip for the duplicate sorry for the late response, thank you for answering me the deposits work perfectly personally.

Maeyanie Awesome, I appreciate the confirmation! I'm doing some testing soon as well to just be sure everything is working fine.

I can confirm it's working in 1.21 for me. Found a copper vein that is definitely not pancake-shaped, and this world was started in 1.21.

It should work in the new update, if it doesn't please post your server.main log here. I'll probably do some testing here in a few days myself.

If there are any issues please give me a thorough description (or screenshots) of the issues. Veins not generating or vanilla veins generating? etc.


ballou Can you triple check to make sure the mod is installed and activated? If it is, then send your server.main and also give me screenshots of the ore generation, that will help me narrow down the issue.

the mod does not work in 1.21 it does not create the huge deposits as it should do an update is necessary hoping that the dev does not struggle too much with this

hgwaz: I can confirm it starts and generates land without any errors... I haven't gotten to the stage of actually going and finding an ore vein yet, so I'm not positive it's actually working.

Does this work with 1.21.0 or will it need an update?

FatherSarge I could still be wrong given the game has a lot more complexity code wise than I was willing to look into in 5 minutes, however I understand it to be different. The ore veins I generate are randomly from maybe ~2000 blocks all the way up to ~10000 blocks of ore. I split the high end at 7500 ore per vein for every vein estimation. (More veins are in the 7500+ range than 5000- range) The code here is what's runs when you do a Propick Density Search specifically in the ore calculation.

public override void GetPropickReading(BlockPos pos, int oreDist, int[] blockColumn, out double ppt, out double totalFactor)
{
int mapheight = Api.World.BlockAccessor.GetTerrainMapheightAt(pos);
int qchunkblocks = mapheight * chunksize * chunksize;

double oreMapFactor = (oreDist & 0xff) / 255.0;
double rockFactor = oreBearingBlockQuantityRelative(pos, variant.Code, blockColumn);
totalFactor = oreMapFactor * rockFactor;

double quantityOres = totalFactor * 7500;                          #This line here in vanilla is a close approximation of how much ore is in each vein, I set it to 7500 for the best results so far, but I didn't do the most extensive work honestly.

double relq = quantityOres / qchunkblocks;
ppt = relq * 1000;
}

The math here shows me that it's a combination of true "physical" ore and then approximate "oremap" ore of what should be there. Again, the 7500 is a stand in but in vanilla there is a variable that is a pretty close approximation of the area of the disc of ore, multiplied by it's height resulting in a pretty close approximation of exactly how much ore is in each disc. I think the "Special number" that can randomly throw ore results out of whack is the oreMapFactor which could potentially be some sort of weird multiplier.

It's really complex to explain, as it goes a lot of different places! So keep in mind this is very simplified, but essentially every time a disc is generated in vanilla it gives a variable that is the absolute/average quantity of the disc (Excluding any deformation or sparseness). This is then rounded and fed into the function in place of my 7500 here, as "absAvgQuantity"
Here is the code for the function used to get the variable "absAvgQuantity":

Radius/Thickness are, to my understanding, a rough approximation of that ore vein's size, varied out 100 times.

public float GetAbsAvgQuantity(LCGRandom rnd)
{
float radius = 0;
float thickness = 0;
for (int j = 0; j < 100; j++)
{
radius += Radius.nextFloat(1, rnd);
thickness += Thickness.nextFloat(1, rnd);
}
radius /= 100;
thickness /= 100;

return thickness * radius * radius * GameMath.PI * variant.TriesPerChunk;
}

This is just my understanding of this code, maybe I have it wrong! 😅


SecretFoxfire Yeah, I am sorry that I'm not able to get a config going for the mod. Although I'm just out of time and motivation right now for doing much on IOG. I work a tech job so most of my day-to-day is literally just debugging scripts for other people, doing that here for "fun" is a really rough time for me hahah.

RosstheGreat Thank you for the response! I understand entirely, I don't have configs on my mods either because they require coding and I just don't know how to do it. If you can manage to find someone willing to help you make one, it would certainly be useful for this mod. But meanwhile, I will see if I can find some time to make a patch mod tweaking the values for those who want a more difficult experience, and I'll let you know if I do.

As for the density mode, FatherSarge's explanation is correct as far as I understand it. It's a frustrating system but it's what we have. However, I don't think it's true that density search doesn't work with this mod. I think it's still working fine. The density readings do not check whether there is actually any ore, they just tell you the % chance that some might have spawned in that chunk. There is always the chance that you get readings for, say, copper, and then there is no copper in the entire area, even in vanilla. Happens to me all the time. (Also frustrating that sometimes you do find the ore, but it's not in the area with the highest readings. I once spent hours (in vanilla) digging for halite in an area with a very high reading and found nothing, then when I gave up and went caving nearby, found the halite right in the middle of the cave, in an area with very low readings.)

So far I've found that overall, the density readings with this mod enabled are roughly the same in terms of accuracy as with vanilla oregen. Sometimes you get a density reading for an ore that turns out to just not be there. But whenever I find ore, it does show up properly on the density readings. I've never found copper and had no copper in the density readings, for example. So I do think it's working. It's just a crappy system that makes it harder to find ore, even in vanilla. If anything, it's easier with this mod, because the size and shape of the deposits sort of spread the ore out when it does spawn, and that makes it more likely that you'll get a positive reading on the node search when there is ore in the area, without having to drill down to the mantle every 16 blocks or whatever trying to get a hit.

RosstheGreat

No worries, I wish I had the specifics for you but as I understand it...

Density mode(pick 3 blocks, get a readout and a map dot) is seed based, it tells the player the likelihood of vanilla ore generation based on the map seed (so when you get a 75% copper reading it means that where copper could spawn in vanilla there was a 75% chance that a vein is generated in that chunk, this happens multiple times in the area resulting in high likelihood of the player finding ore). If the player were to mine out every block in the given area save for 3 blocks necessary to prospect, it would still show this 75% number. It does not reflect the real ore in the area at all and will never change.

Node mode, and it's derivatives in different types of node modes found in the Absolute Prospecting mod, shows the player the real amount of ore in an area (for vanilla node mode this is a 6-12 block radius depending on config around the block that is prospected). The player gets readings such as "No Ore" and "Trace Amounts of ____" etc for these mods and they correspond with real ore (the game actually checks the blocks) in the area so this will change as the player removes ore. If you get a trace reading, ore is there for sure. Unlike density mode.

Your mod disables vanilla ore gen (which is good because it's annoyingly boring to mine and find) but whatever system density mode uses to give its values is still there, thus the disconnect.

Interesting Ore Gen working with density mode would be a "nice to have" if you ever wanted to tackle it but not having it is hardly a dealbreaker, even with extremely low global ore gen, Absolute Prospecting works just fine with your mod.

Obv FatherSarge
Preface: I haven't touched the mod in months so excuse me if some of my information is incorrect here. From what I remember Prospecting is composed of accurate data (raw actual amounts of ore under the ground) and inaccurate data (Something that messes with the data, like Oremap which I have no idea what it does, among other things.) this can result in some really weird values if one or the other gets whacky.

SecretFoxfire
As I said above I've not touched this project in a long time. I'm not totally sure how to do configs, but I've been talking to some people who might end up adding some stuff to the mod. IF you want go ahead and make a tweaker that drops ore rates, I'm happy to put an endorsement or something on the main page here.

Also if anyone ever needs to contact me (faster) feel free to send me a DM in discord (same username) or under the IOG thread in the Vintage Story discord. (ping me)

I absolutely love the new deposit shapes and how much more genuinely interesting the oregen is with this mod (true to the name!) but I put this on a world with 10% oregen (the lowest the game allows you to set it) and within just a couple weeks of gameplay had found more copper, tin, lead, gold, silver, and iron than I could ever possibly use. I almost never even had to prospect, it was just visible, often right on the surface or just inside a cave.

A config for the mod would be really helpful, so folks who need/want a ton of ore can keep it as it is, but those who are looking for a challenge can make it harder. I specifically added the mod to a challenge server for my community thinking it would make it harder to find ore, especially at 10% generation and with no surface copper or tin, but it wound up being the opposite. They had so much ore so quickly that they were struggling to make enough storage space to keep it all (mostly because the rest of the mods I added really did make progression much more difficult, so they didn't have quick access to planks for chests and such). I was actually wondering if it might be some kind of bug in the mod that sets the oregen rate far higher than it should be, but I'm not sure how that would happen.

I could tweak the jsons myself for a single-player world, but for a server, I can't make any changes or else they won't be able to download the mod when they connect. If it's not feasible to make a config for the mod, maybe someone (possibly me if I can find the time, although there never seems to be enough of that) might fiddle with the json files and make a tweak mod that can be downloaded alongside this one and modify some of the values for a more difficult experience... 🤔

RosstheGreat

No worries, there's always the brute force method of Absolute Prospecting lol

Obv

You are correct in your understanding of density mode. It's really not a mechanic I like personally but it's what we have. I suspect it's just a disconnect between vanilla ore gen and this mod's superior(😜) ore gen. It's an... unfriendly system to work with. I can assure you though... I only gave one example. The luck was coming across a chunk that properly aligned with what density mode said and what would actually be there. It might be a "bug" with the ore gen but I consider it more an issue with how density mode is implemented. I assume it is done that way for performance though.

FatherSarge

I might be misunderstanding my own knowledge of the ore gen system but the per-mille readings from prospecting accounts for all ore theoretically in the chunk. The actual chance for a spawn, showing as Decent, Poor, etc., are the underlying modifiers for the ore map. Native copper faults always try to spawn 0.125 per chunk, but a poor reading disregards 80~%(?) of successful tries. Where as plentiful guarantees a spawn, if the original try succeeds.

Iron, has 0.1 * 3 (for all deposit types). It could just mean that you got incredibly lucky for iron and unlucky for copper at the same time.

If there's a way to check world gen logs for the attempted generation tries including success and failure, it would at least confirm if your experience is a bug or intended mechanics. Sadly, I'm pretty useless as to figuring that part out. 

FatherSarge Odd... I wont have time to fix it anytime soon, but prospecting was a really hard thing to fix last I looked into it. I wonder if the devs changed it?

Otherwise I have no idea. I kind of ad-hoc'ed a fix for the prospecting last time, it's likely that breaking.

RosstheGreat

So I'm testing this out on 1.21.0-rc3, ore gen is working well... but prospecting density mode is giving off tons of false readings again. I know you have messed around and fixed a prospecting bug similar this is the past, as an example, I have a denisty reading showing 12% copper where there is no copper for several hundred blocks, but there is a miniscule reading for 2 different irons that have giant vains present. I'm hoping this can get fixed so Propsecting Together can work as intended on the server I'm hoping to set up.

I hope you still have it in you to look into this a bit and get it polished back up for the new version.

Congrats on the new job btw!

Ensorcelled That's really weird, I've *never* seen that happen before... Are you using more mods than IOG? I've ran it perfectly fine on 6 gb before, it chugs but it runs. What game version as well?

Endurance Ah, yeah it's very polar with this. About half the people say it's too easy, about half the people say it makes prospecting too hard. Originally this was built in mind with making mining far more difficult and more engaging but I've moved onto other projects and very shortly after publishing my mod started a new job. I likely wont be developing any new mods for VS anytime soon, and that's why I've not really updated this either. If ore spawns are too much hit "Global Deposit Spawn Rate" down to 20%, that will give you a pretty sizable reduction in ore spawns. Worst case, play with the JSON files and find ore spawn rates you like and send them to me on discord, I'd be happy to upload them as better changes.

I do remember Iron being relatively common, or completely barren in half the world (depending on strata) so I do understand the frustration. Unfortunately without redoing the entire world generator (which I honestly considered) this was kind of my lowest effort route to implement something to give the people who just want different ore shapes. I myself dislike mining in vanilla just because it is always a disk, and always really boring, there's no fun to mining them. I don't mind the larger ore sizes because I play with a lot of mods as well that are high in metal demand. I think for the about 1 month stint of this I played some time ago, I mined out 4 whole large copper veins (well in excess of 50,000 ore) and still needed more. 😅

This mod is super cool! But I wanna warn everyone that it does make the game a whole lot easier! The larger size of ore patches makes them very easy to find by looking into caves and iron ore close to the surface is surprisingly common from my experience. I'd recommend turning down the deposit chance for a more vanilla level balance experience 

So, just recently as we expaned our world map, we have been getting crashes: version 1.2.0 

It is generating out of memory errors in interesting ore gen, but we have plenty of memory available... 

Commandermartin Incredible, could you send me your mod list and anything that you can do to consistently recreate that issue? Feel free to do so here or on the IOG thread in the official Vintage Story discord. (Link: https://discord.com/channels/302152934249070593/1367581350118428794)

From what I could gather there are occasionally issues with ore veins being rendered from a chunk that isn't loaded yet, but when the chunk is loaded the ore isn't properly rendered. That's kind of my only clue on what might be going on, but I don't have any solid evidence as to what the real cause is. I haven't ever been able to recreate it on my machine or my personal server.

Hey RosstheGreat I am actually experiencing the ghost ore issues. Whatever the ore is only shows up as its native rock type. I have reloaded the game multiple times and it does not seem to fix the issue. How can I fix this?

-Edit Reloading sometimes fixes it; two reloads didnt, but the third finally did

Emu3008 It's not tested but I wrote the code with different world heights in mind. It should still work just fine but it isn't scaled appropriately for anything larger than prob 512 blocks in world height. (Again, larger! smaller is fine). To clarify it should work regardless of world height, the veins shouldn't stretch or deform any but they might be a bit small relative to scale on extremely large worlds. For the pictures, I've not gotten back around to working on the modpage unfortunately, at one point I had images on the page but because they were discord host images they disappear after a few days. Just haven't gotten around to hosting them somewhere else. As for the handbook pages, it's not something I've tried yet but I wouldn't mind adding a bit more flavor to the mod.

I've been on break from Vintage since about the mod's release, I likely wont be updating anything anytime soon given I'm quite busy irl. I set aside about 30 minutes a day to check the mod discord and DB page just to make sure any questions are answered. 😅

is this mod tested for worlds that have a world height higher than the default? also i think it would be neat if you could have visual depictions of the different generations as well as adding a brief description of the vein types in the handbook

Rodar It should. I've used it to 1.20.10 but I haven't tried anything beyond that I don't believe.

should this work with newer versions of 1.20?

GOODYOB Should do, I don't see why it wouldn't.

Will this mod work on 1.20.7?

Last I checked yes Dumb_Box I haven't personally tested the newer versions of TP but it should be perfectly fine. IOG should work with all landform and terrain mods.

does this mod work with terra pretty

badgerson
1.2.0 and 1.2.3 are only ore quantity changes, I mark these versions of the mod as completely stable and fully functional. There was a small issue, at the request of WatermelonFroggy for versions 1.2.1 and 1.2.2 where I tried implementing it so ore would only be exposed at certain depths, and my quick ad-hoc implementation wasn't up to my usual standard. I pulled those, so as long as you're using only 1.2.0 or 1.2.3 (1.2.3 has 50% ore gen chance) then you're perfectly fine.

I have also updated the Bugs and Issues page to reflect the 1 currently known issue with the mod, and I'm not really sure it's even from my mod because of it's inconsistency.

Richeeze
According to some posts from people in the TP thread it appears this is likely a Terra Prety issue, as it happens without my mod. What version of my mod are you using? And can you send me your worldgen log, and server.main log? Ideally through the official VS discord - IOG thread, it'll be faster.

https://discord.com/channels/302152934249070593/1367581350118428794

Hey so I am using 1.2.0 of this mod on a server with a couple of friends. Would you consider it experimental? Unbalanced? Buggy? Did i make a grave mistake? So far it seems to work fairly well, lots of tin in cliffs but that's not an issue for us...

Hello, from my current testing it seems that this mod doesnt work with the new Terra Pretty 7.0.2. When I load this mod, it just generates empty chunks. 

SubtleOrc 
I would enjoy making that a config, unfortunately the way I went about implementing it was ad-hoc and actually caused an immense amount of log spam. It didn't seem to cause any lag but feel free to use 1.2.2 and let me know if it works for you, it should still expose ore below a certain depth but keep everything above it hidden.

I just wouldn't recomend 1.2.1 or 1.2.2 IOG versions as they will spam logs. Again, no lag on my machine but it's also decently beefy.

"UPDATE:
Added a quick patch to make it so ore doesn't spawn in exposed caves or exposed to air. (Will still spawn exposed to water but this is a rare occurance anyway)"

Would be nice to make that configurable.. gives us more of a reason to go cave diving if we find some ore veins in it .. i know froggy and his server didnt like it, but i would quite like that in my single player world.

UPDATE 1.2.3:


Adjusted ore generation on all major metal ores and sulfur. Overall ores spawn about 50% less frequently than prior updates, except Malachite and Rhodochrosite. Those spawn infrequently to begin with and malachite is especially quite uncommon. (Plus it's my favorite ore :P)

Changed ore generation to only spawn ore (exposed to air) below 40% world height. This is based on absolute world height not on surface level. Assuming ground level is 50-70% world height, often you wont find ore exposed on the surface. This check ONLY looks for air blocks though, so you can still find ore peaking out behind tall grass! 😁 Often you wont find veins nearer the surface in caves though. My method for doing this ended up not working, and I didn't catch it in the dev environment. (I was a little rushed today) so this feature is, for now, put on the backburner and is NOT currently implemented

DO NOT USE VERSIONS 1.2.1 AND/OR 1.2.2


(Thanks again for Sky_StarBlade and others from the Age of Seraphs discord for the suggestion!)

Wahazar
Yeah basically it was on request from WatermelonFrogy, Worst case revert to 1.2.0 or don't use 1.2.1, no changes should have been made between versions.

Updating as well, post above. Thanks Sky_StarBlade for the suggestion, and some people from WatermelonFrogy's server, I implemented the world dependant issues.

Maybe ores could still be exposed to air below sea level? Like somewhere around 20 blocks below sea level or so? That way caving is still rewarding, but you don't get free easy surface ores?

I had basically begged for it in his DMs xD

Having them exposed made finding ore really easy since the veins were much more likely to hit a cave due to their increased size.

We've done probably too much testing on my server and even with 20% ore distribution it still felt like there was more ore than vanilla with 100%

You could always go back to the previous version because the only thing that changed in this was the exposed ore.

And it doesn't spawn when exposed to air

I also think I waas going to look at the possibility of making panning part of prospecting

There is already Pan and Prospect mod, where prospecting density is stored in gravel/sand when picked from given location (average used if mixed).

ore doesn't spawn in exposed caves or exposed to air

What is a reason of such patch? Cave prospecting was dangerous but rewarding thing in VS...

UPDATE:
Added a quick patch to make it so ore doesn't spawn in exposed caves or exposed to air. (Will still spawn exposed to water but this is a rare occurance anyway)

Wahazar
It's among the plans for the other sister mods. iirc (not looking at my notes) there's plants, water, protrusions of ore or other minerals, as well as physical landform depressions or laccolithic spires, and several others I'm forgetting. I also think I waas going to look at the possibility of making panning part of prospecting, or maybe using the prospecting pickaxe to break off chunks of stone and then panning the samples (after crushing) to get your ore concentrations, or something. That all would be total reworks of the prospecting system, as well as other types of generation I've not delved into and again is a very long ways out if/when I get around to it.

About indicators, I had idea to add plants as an ore indicators (geobotanical prospecting), where some plants may (with both false negative and false positive probability) spawn above deep ore deposits.

Unfortunaely it is not possible using just json, due to hardcoded 10 block depth limitation of surface indicators.

Wahazar
Actually that's how vanilla ore works, depending on distribution. Because of how I made my placement logic, I believe implementation of a distribution system like vanilla would actually be quite difficult with how I currently have things set up.
It was suggested to make ore veins have less "ore" in them through making the ore veins porous, something I might look into in the far future but for now the mod serves it's design goals perfectly, and I found it insanely frustrating in my testing of early versions of this mod mining ore that ended up being "fractured" as we don't have some sort of base material to follow like in real life. Normally you'll always see some sign of a vein (broken rock or a very thin layer of the vein, etc.), but in VS, because it's a blockgame, you can have fractured ore pieces away from the vein you'll have no indication of following. Eventually the plan was to use a tracer rock to define the vein (think quartz with Silver in Vanilla) but it ended up not really working the way I wanted, so we got solid veins instead.

Eventually, my plan is to implement 2 sister mods with this to make mining the interesting part of gameplay. The plan is to make it similar to TFC's support system, but with a bit of added flair and a few more interesting mechanics, make mining harder overall but more rewarding, and add a blasting rock system and then the 2nd mod is to remove the need for the prospecting pickaxe entirely and replace it with surface indications of veins beneath, such as finding a large sinkhole with a laccolithic dome at the bottom, or breccia pipe structures, large seams of quartz or faults of other mineralized and poorer qualities of ore, and probably even soil and water discoloration. These would give the idea there is ore under you but not where, so it would then be up to you to make mineshafts into the region and find the large, but rather hard to find, ore deposits.

These ideas are a long ways out, I'm on break right now from modding to work on some different projects and wont get back to it for quite a time. I can still post fixes and minor updates but nothing game changing. No exact ETA but I'd say probably 12+ months.

In contrary to TFC predecessor, where ores block were mixed with host rock blocks , VS ore generation is just plain homogenous, boring disc.

This mod add some interesting deposit shapes, but still 100% of ore spawn withing vein boundary. 

I propose to modify Banded generator to have probability of ore block spawn decreasing with the distance of the disc center - mining would be more interesting, with additional strategies (to dig more or not to dig).

Let me know how you like it and if you have screenshots of your mines or further feedback, feel free to send them in the Interesting Ore Gen mod thread on the Vintage Story discord!

IOG Thread on the Official Vintage Story discord.
https://discord.com/channels/302152934249070593/1367581350118428794

I played this game with 5 friends and we all quit at various points in time because mining for ore is absolute garbage in vanilla. I'm definitely going to try this and if it's anything close to as advertised I will be able to get the gang back together.🤠

SLEDGE_HAMMER Yeah that's a totally doable feature, although I wont be updating for quite some time (at least post 1.21 for VS) unless there is a major bug or feature lacking. Cinnabar is a mineral as well and I just didn't really bother with minerals truthfully. Sulfur is the only exception as I was testing it on a new oregen feature and just kept it in.

Would it be possible to make cinnabar spawn in hydrothermal-type formations near the surface? chimneys, hydrotubes, etc...

RosstheGreat Interesting! I'm not as savvy in everything as I'd like to be, or I'd offer my hand assisting with the patch without any hesitation. The only thing I do know, from what I've personally been dabbling with lately, is that load order issues can be rectified by setting dependencies. If the only issue thus far is that GA loads after the fact, have you considered, just for testing purposes, setting a dependency on GA for your mod, so it'd load after GA, or specifically separating the GA behaviors as their own separate patch, and then giving that new patch mod its own dependencies in the modinfo to IOG and GA? 

Of course, I'd be more than happy to help out testing or any of the more miserable legwork. I'll probably try to get in touch on Discord, in regards to that.

Zepper202 To give you a rough explanation, prospecting is unfortunately not absolute, but takes a rough value of how many spawn chances there are for an ore in a region, multiplies it by how much ore is in each deposit, and does some other math on it to give you your PPT readings. As my ore deposits are entirely random I generalize all ore deposits to have approximately 5000 to 7500 ore in it. You might have an area where your stone layer for that specific ore (hematite in this case) is super thin, and that's causing your readings to get messed up. However if that isn't the case, I genuinely don't know why you're having an issue. Hematite is the only ore in my mod that is entirely vanilla. I only make the deposits larger, and slightly less frequent. Otherwise it is the same generator that is built into vanilla.

If you're using Rock Strata Variety that can also cause issues with thin stone layers, I would recommend against using that mod, as most of my ores depend on thick stone layers.




Vigilance Truthfully I don't know what will happen if you combine the two, but what I assume will happen is you'll get GA ores in GA stone, and Vanilla ores in Vanilla stone. As per your example you wont get Native Copper spawning in Mudstone, although you might get Chalcocite spawning in limestone (or wherever it would spawn normally in Vanilla stones). That's because my mod only disables vanilla metal-ore generation, not the generation from GA. It would mean any and all GA ores spawn as discs where they should spawn normally, and there's a possibility of them spawning normally in normal stones too.

Also, it's not that I left GA out on purpose. I had actually written a patch for it, but it didn't work. For some reason registering GA stones in my mod causes it to crash, and the only explanation I can find is that GA loads after my mod loads, causing my mod to reference things that don't exist yet. It might require a totally seperate mod to work but that is a monumental amount of patching I'd have to do, and even then it's not totally guarenteed to work. The best solution I can find is having GA patch it in themselves as it would be easier and more stable anyway. If you want to do some testing or know much about JSON patching I'd be happy to have someone assist me on it as well.

IOG Thread on the Official Vintage Story discord.
https://discord.com/channels/302152934249070593/1367581350118428794

I think there still might be an issue with prospecting, at least for iron.

I started using the previous version of the mod before the prospecting bug was fixed. I prospected an area with very high hematite at the richest chunk, but after excavating several shafts down to the mantle I got no hematite readings. Eventually I used the block overlay mod to see where the ore was, but there was actually nothing in the entire area that was supposedly rich. I saw that the new version was supposed to fix prospecting readings, so I updated the mod, deleted all my old readings, and prospected the same area again. The chunk with the very high reading updated to an ultra high one, but again there's no iron in that area. Not sure if something's broken or I'm just very unlucky.

RosstheGreat I think that's a super valid reason to axe GA, and cut it out of the initial scope/focus. Unfortunately, as far as my "group" goes, I'm the rockhound, so... unfortunately... :)

I couldn't particularly imagine a world I don't have my obtuse quantity of extra rocks and minerals, even if it would lead to a lot less headaches overall for me when it came to... Well, all manner of things, but mostly mod compatibility. I'm just worried, because if I had to rely entirely on GA's ores to populate GA's rocks... I guess it depends what that'd mean? Like, native copper discs not generating in, say, mudstone? Naturally I'm not expecting it to just magically spit out Chalcocite veins in your mod's fashion, or even for native copper to generate in GA rocks by your mod's methods, but my interpretation meant ore gen would get very silly in an undesirable way should I jump the gun and throw the mod in as it stands.

Vigilance Because to get my new oregen to work I decided to patch vanilla ore spawn to 0. This is to prevent accidental overlap, but also because if I were to patch my new JSON modifiers into the vanilla oregen it would flat out cause crashes with other mods. This was the safest way to run it. I'm almost certain you can run IOG and GA together, they just wont interact at all, but also shouldn't crash or cause any errors. Hopefully.

Also, I stopped using GA a long time ago mainly because it bloated the ore pool too much. A lot of the people I run with in my server ended up disliking having so many different ore types (most of them aren't "geology savvey") so chalcocite and chalocopyrite giving half the ore ended up being more annoying than immersive for most of them. I still love GA, and I think it'd be really cool to add back on my server some day but for now I must remain with the vanilla ores on my server.

Out of curiosity, why does this mod break vanilla ores within GA stones? I was thinking about it, and if it just left the old ore gen for their stones and used yours for vanilla stone layers, that'd almost be tolerable to use it as-is until a GA patch came. On the other hand, it's probably just better to wait for a proper compatibility than bargaining and making compromises. Lol.

I'm still very excited about this. In an alternate universe, maybe my next server will do away with GA just to try this oregen out. Fantastic idea, and it brings me a lot of joy to see attention to detail being paid to systems like this.

Alright, thanks for the info, RosstheGreat.

I appreciate the clarification! Hope everything is situated now! 😄

Alright,this error has nothing to do with your mod,i just touched some configs i shouldn't have 😅

VladTheG Interesting... I've never had any error like that whatsoever, can you send me your server.main and your full modlist? It would be easier over the discord to help, but for now try just using my mod (No other ones) and load the same seed in a different world.

I run a modpack of 190+ mods and while it can be laggy at times on my pc, it never has caused me this issue.

I realy liked this mod from the desriptions,but now i'm trying to create a new world to play with it,and i'm getting an error:

Exception: Somehow worldgen has become stuck in an endless loop, please report this as a bug! Additional data in the server-main log
at Vintagestory.Server.ServerSystemSupplyChunks.loadChunkAreaBlocking(Int32 chunkX1, Int32 chunkZ1, Int32 chunkX2, Int32 chunkZ2, Boolean isStartupLoad, ITreeAttribute chunkGenParams) in VintagestoryLib\Server\Systems\World\LoadThread\SupplyChunks.cs:line 1793
at Vintagestory.Server.ServerSystemSupplyChunks.InitWorldgenAndSpawnChunks() in VintagestoryLib\Server\Systems\World\LoadThread\SupplyChunks.cs:line 1537
at Vintagestory.Server.ServerSystemLoadAndSaveGame.OnWorldgenStartup() in VintagestoryLib\Server\Systems\World\LoadThread\LoadSaveGame.cs:line 198
at Vintagestory.Server.ServerEventManager.<>c.<TriggerWorldgenStartup>b__112_0(Action dele) in VintagestoryLib\Server\ServerEventManager.cs:line 448
at Vintagestory.Server.ServerEventManager.Trigger[T](Delegate[] delegates, String eventName, Action`1 onDele, Action onException) in VintagestoryLib\Server\ServerEventManager.cs:line 718

I have way to many mods,but i've played with them for a while,and the game was semistable,and this error appeared after i installed this mod

Froshure Changing the global deposit spawn rate should reduce overall spawn rate, but I haven't done extensive testing on it.

I assume you mean on a block-for-block basis. How many blocks of ore does my mod spawn compared to vanilla, and the answer should overall be "less" but it's hard to tell you for certain. If you're asking on a "per deposit" basis, the answer is  substantially less than vanilla, but I make up for that by making the veins overall much larger.

I want to add, though, this is purely from my testing. I have no hard evidence for one way or another, but I tried to create something less matching vanilla but more for the design concept of "Large but somewhat rare deposits" with the addition of "establishing infrastructure for your mine".

Does changing the "Global deposit spawn rate" option in world generation settings affect this mod?

And with this mod, how realistic would you say the quantity of ore generated is?; is it more, less, or about equal to the quantity of ore generated in vanilla VS?

This seems really interesting! Will definitely try it out on my new server ♥

I'm happy you like it! I'm incredibly pleased with how the mod turned out. 😄

This is incredible and I love it, thank you so much!

Mollycoddle You shouldn't need it, no, none of my ore veins are sea-level deterministic.

Just want to check, if I'm using this I don't need the sea level fix mod, right?

Undea It shouldn't change terrain form at all, it only changes deposit generation. I don't think there will be an issue but make a backup of your world first! I'm not familiar with WorldgenFix, but if it doesn't mess with ore at all then it should be totally fine.

hi,

if you use it in an old save, how does the border from old to new look? could we get the ugly line, between old and new terrain?

and i have a 512 world with WorldgenFix how is the compatibline there?

Jalex All new ore shapes can spawn in newly generated chunks. If you started a new world recently it shouldn't be too big of a deal, you maybe have only explored a few thousand blocks. Just update the mod and any new veins should generate in newly formed chunks, and I apologize for the update spam, I had finished the previous update and when I started talking to the GA devs it reminded me I had a generator I needed to finish and I also needed to get sub-deposits functioning. As of current this should be the last major update for a long time.

Jomeaga I tried my best to reach a happy medium for most people. Some people will want a single deposit every thousand blocks, and some will want a dozen per chunk (exaggeration but you get my point), if you want less spawn rate it's very easy to unpackage the mod and drop the spawn amounts in the JSONs, I'm happy to explain it in detail if you're interested! If you find an amount you like I am happy to make a "Hardcore" patch mod for it as well for others to use. I tried my best to make the spawn rate sort of match vanilla ore density, but unfortunately I'm able to test this only so far on my own.

Do the new Ore Shapes generate on already existing saves, or do I have to start another one ... again lol

I love this mod, mining is my favourite part of the game and I've been waiting for something to make it feel more worthwhile to setup a mine! However, I think the generation chance is currently way too generous. Even set to 20% spawn rate, there are tons of deposits of thousands of blocks of ore...

Updated!

Looks promising! The only thing stopping me from trying it right now is compatibility with GA.

Updated!

Fixed the prospecting bug, found the reason and all should be well now. You'll notice much higher concentratons of ore in an area, as average deposit amount per chunk has vastly increased when you're near an ore vein!
Also decreased silver spawn rate by approximately 25%

ShyishHazard I agree, I actually had intended to include some patching to the cavein code when I first set out to create this mod, and ended up going through with it in testing! However it ended up making mining so unpredictable because supports don't really work ingame. Highly recommend the "Post and Beam" mod though even for just the looks!

Tyan Indeed! The intention is harder to find veins but once you do the mines will almost require infrastructure to be set up! And, as for the sea level/mountain generation I purposely left a few ores in high spawns to get "horizontal" mines as opposed to ladder vertical mines. I want to use Rust and Railroads in my next personal server so I made sure we'd get some mines like that.

love the new ore vein shapes and this is amazing since it makes setting up an actual mine to work a specific vein (rather than just endlessly digging shafts and prospecting smaller veins) possible.

I'd love to see more above sea level ore generation so that mountains and large scale hilly areas have more ore. Lots of ore is still far down below sea level.

some of these formations would certainly make mining more interesting, the current disc-only situation makes playing with cave-ins enabled a relative non-issue

As soon as this gets a Geology Additions patch, I'm going to give myself nightmares grafting it in to my ongoing world. This looks very on par with what I've been wanting.

Shion I totally feel that! 😓 I have started several worlds because I found a new mod that added new generation of some kind and wanted the ability to play with it sooner rather than later! The woes of selection! hahah

Mods like these make me want to start a new world every time, which is why I never got to the steel age >_<

I was unaware EM changed ores? Haven't tried it, but I'll look into it.

Edit: Looked into it, from a very light search it doesn't appear I effect any of the ores it's patching, it should be 100% compatible.

Does this work with Expanded Matter/is any compatibility planned? EM's ore changes are pretty miniscule, but they still exist.

Aloy
Yes, this should work with all standard world gen mods! 😄

does it work with other world gen mods like vanillaplus worldgen?

this looks great, looking forward to geo additons so I can yolo this into my existing world =D

HaraiseTenshi The bug only effects the output % number, I suspect it's because the ore concentration is technically way less than vanilla per chunk. I did notice in very dense areas in my testing it will bump up the percent (for example 0.01%%). The readings are still accurate, but I also haven't tested this extensively yet. And, again, I'm not really sure why this is happening.

Basically, if you ignore the numerical output it should still give you a good chance of finding ore. I am hunting that bug best I can though! 😅

Geology additions is not currently integrated but it should work with vanilla ores in vanilla stone. I just haven't gotten the energy to write a patch for Geology Additions yet truthfully!

If the prospecting bug can be fixed I am so gonna add this one :)

This is pure mad genius!

 my god, this is exactly what I wanted. Small Question, are you planning to also add Geology Additions Extra Ores to this?

That looks absolutely amazing. Do you know if it happens to work with Geology Additions?

Excited to see this, it's exactly what I've been looking for out of the game. Can't wait to try it out!!!